Lived Experience Forum

[wellwellwellnez]

Most of my mental health issues are around fear and trust so it's hard to separate physical from emotional risk right now. The close people in my life have significantly different positions than me when it comes to covid safety. I'm definitely the "pro-safety" one and they are "pro-freedom". This feels like it's going to have long term affects on our relationships.

I've become steadily accustomed to having my needs pushed aside from a psychological point of view. I've tried to meet that scenario with patience because mental illness can be hard to understand and invisible in a lot of ways. It's still very painful. Now it's not just about my wellbeing. Now it's about the physical and mental wellbeing of me and countless others.

No matter how many times I turn it in my head, I keep coming up with, relationships without duty of care aren't relationships (we simply can't/won't relate). At best, they're associations and they're associations that carry significant risks. Seems like a whole lot of work on these relationships has been pretty largely undone. It also feels like operation: rebuild my emotional attachments, is pretty much back to square one. To me it seems the result of people choosing the "experience" of love over the "act" of love. Or in other words they want me to trust them but aren't interested in honouring or earning that trust. It's an impass.

I guess these are my opinions. They're also the only opinions I'm likely to have because those opinions are based on my values and those values are based on my real world assessment. I look forward to one day maybe being able to share my life with people that reflect my values. Just, right now, not sure how that's most likely to happen.

For now, I'm glad I've got you fair peoples. This tricky time has gotten to a tricky phase.

[frog]

Hi @wellwellwellnez I share a lot of your concerns. Covid is really testing all sorts of relationships and social contracts. There have been some heartwarming stories of community, but sometimes I feel shocked by examples of diregard for others' physical and emotional wellbeing. It's really frustrating and sad if you bump up against it in your close relationships. One of mine is fixated on 'the economy' and 'opening up' and I wonder whether it's a fundamental difference that is going to be front and centre once we can see each other post lockdown.

It's not the same as connecting irl, but I just wanted to say that I respect what you are saying.

[Daisydreamer]

Hi @wellwellwellnez,

It's something so many people are going through in their social circles at the moment, and I am really glad that you have reached out to raise this here. It's hard to see the people we love and care about hold different perspectives that could be potentially harmful to their wellbeing and the wellbeing of others. It can erode trust. This is something I have found hard to hold in my social circles too and have had to put up some clear boundaries. 

I'm hearing trust is a core value in your relationships and that the expectations of friends to have a relationship without trust is really difficult. When you have spoken with people in your networks with whom trust have been broken, have you communicated this to them before?

Really appreciate you sharing your opinions here @wellwellwellnez  There are so many people who would relate to this experience in social settings at the moment

[wellwellwellnez]

Thanks for the hearing the things. Unfortunately, while communication has helped with most instances, it's leading only to mutual frustration in one or two particular people. I'm giving the effort of communication without the pay-off of understanding and I'm at the point where I need to self-destruct or cut my losses. I think I can muster diplomacy, however, internally, I'm grieving the end of our relationship. At least for now (maybe forever. But it's too soon to tell).

It's haunting to be so comfortable with this cold sort of feeling. But, the feelings I was feeling before this coldness, I simply don't want to feel anymore. I choose choice. That's what I know right now.

[HenryX]

To: @wellwellwellnez , @Daisydreamer , @frog 

and other visitors to this thread

@Zoe7 , @WIP , @utopia , @TAB , @TheVorticon , @The-Hams , @TideisTurning , @Smc , @Sophia1 , @Shaz51 , @Schitzo , @Scoo , @Snowie , @Sans911 , @Peri , @outlander , @oceangirl , @Olga , @Owen45 , @NikNik , @NatureLover , @MumO , @Mumslove , @Meowmy , @Liberty , @Lee82 , @Kurra , @Jacques , @Judi9877 , @Historylover , @greenpea , 

@Faith-and-Hope , @FindingStrength , @frog , @Eve7 , @Exoplanet , @Emelia8 , @eth , @Elac , @Dec , @Dimity , @Determined , @Clawde , @cloudcore , @CalmingNature , @BlueBay , @Bellarose75 , @Bezak482 , @BPDSurvivor , @Bow , @Arizona , @Appleblossom , @Always-hope , @Adge , @Angels333 , @Anastasia , Ant7

I hope there may be others who would wish to participate in this discussion.

I am sure that all of the people in our social contact areas have issues with “the virus”, and the resulting impositions and effects. Some people are older and at risk. Now, with other variants appearing, the affected age range is widening. Other people have businesses where they can see years of work and, in many cases, the potential loss of not only income, but the start-up and maintenance costs of operation. Others have the constant close proximity of family, which places particular strains on relationships, not to mention the risks for many. There is a huge range of effects, not only in our own communities, states, and country, but the world.

I really do not think that we can simply discount the situation, or position of someone else, because it does not match or conform with our own. If we do so, then we are acting in a manner that is inconsistent with the way that we want them to treat us. The situation that exists at the present time is one that is testing and will continue to test our relationships. However, we can place our position on the table, so to speak, and invite others to do the same. Rather than seeing our selves in polarised and opposite positions, we can declare whatever self-care arrangements that meet our needs, and offer, in whatever way that we can, to support others in and with theirs. We can acknowledge and accept those arrangements that differ from our own, with the rider that we do our best not to operate in conflict with the declared, different or possible countering positions, of the other people around us. We exchange those agreements, requesting that others acknowledge and respect our position. We treat others with consideration. We do not have to take adversarial positions that only cause further and added distress and disharmony.

Boundaries are not just a right for ourselves, they can be protective mechanisms that do not need to be viewed as our own defensive and alienating fortresses. They can be independently declared positions that can be mutually accepted, acknowledged, respected and supported. We need to be looking further than the differences and seeking ways that we can support and nurture others, with mutual respect and concern. We may even be able to recommend, for others, boundaries that could be beneficial and protective for them, even if those same boundaries would not suit ourselves in our particular situation.

This is definitely a time when we need to practice, not only self care, but something, I believe, that has been sorely lacking in our society. We have simply had it so good and relatively easy, that we have rarely had the need, and consequently, the opportunity to practice negotiation skills in our everyday lives. Now is definitely a time when we need to start applying those skills and attributes. If we cannot state our own position and acknowledge and respect the position and views held by others, even though we may disagree, what chance would we have if/when the s**t really hits the fan, say in a time of military conflict, which, unfortunately, is not too far from the realms of possibility, in the foreseeable future.

The positives at the present time, seem to me to be, that we have the vaccinations available in record time, we have no apparent prospect of lack of day to day provisions, Including deliveries if required, or deemed prudent. We do have the means of communication with nearly everyone who may be near and dear to us. While there are certain sanctions on movement, they, hopefully, appear to be relatively short term. We still have access to mental and physical health resources.

I do hope that others can add to the list of positives.

With My Very Best Wishes & Hope

for a

Mutually Supportive, Considerate, Meaningful Social Structure

and future

@HenryX 

Edit: 1.45 pm Sat 28th Aug.  Added paragraph on boundaries

[Adge]

A Very Good & Insightful Reflection @HenryX Thanks.

I will Re-Read it later, & see if I have anything to contribute.

Adge

[wellwellwellnez]

@HenryX @Daisydreamer @frog thanks to you all. Immaculate feedback. Simply top-class.

Things have progressed and I want to keep documenting. I blew up sooner than I expected. Which I suppose is generally how it happens. I woke up to an amount of minutes where I wasn't processing home safety. Feeling that contrast filled me with a sense of urgency.

I'm glad I took the time to process because my emotional volatility was considerably high. At the same time I regret not being able to intercede into this situation in an effective way without the extended processing.

You do learn a lot from conflict and this is what I learned. We're both not coping. That's what it came down within seconds of the conversation. Our situation, as it stood was that one had to cope, therefore the other had to deal (while not coping). It's not the first time me and this person have run into this paradigm.

Therefore, the problem is the paradigm. The solution is mutual coping. It's the only solution. It's not a simple process but the commitment makes it achieveable. What I know right now is that I want to focus as much as possible on early intervention.

Hydras have many heads, so its best to go straight for the feet, guts, etc.

[Sophia1]

Hello @HenryX  thank you so much for leading me here....

@wellwellwellnez  thank you so much for creating a space where we can converse in a civil, respectful manner about a subject that is not going to go away..

@Daisydreamer lovely to see encouragement for a person bravely starting a new thread..

@Adge ..I am with you ...I have so much to say in response....the floodgates have opened and confusion reigns within my clouded mind at the moment...

I think it is best if I read along....

am going to settle myself and hopefully my mind in taking this approach....

I am looking forward to what comes next....

Sophia 1

[Lauralou]

I was married for 33 yrs to a closet gay.

He was ina position to launder money.

So he took money from lifelong friends and took it with him to Thailand.

How I hate that I was alone in my marriage and he undermined me in every way 

I was the lover.  I was a failure. But I raised 3 beautiful people in spite of him

God, we have some issues.  Covid sucks

All I wish for is my family to hug me.

The loneliness sucks.

All m friends deserted me cause they thought I knew.  But I was the sucker keeping my children safe by myself while he was partying on their money.

[HenryX]

Hello @Lauralou 

I can sympathise with your situation that comes in many forms, guises and disguises, for different people.

It is true that the current virus situation is preventing many people from being near those they love. It is even worse when we feel as though we have been treated in the way that you describe.

Your children, I hope, are in contact with you. It can sound trite to comment on other people's achievements when we know little about them. However, I really do hope that, through Your children, there are often special times, through which you know that your best was great.

With My Best Wishes

@HenryX